Thoughts on 2-lane Race

[Pack 187]

Just joined the forum today! Been looking around for a while. Lots of good info here.

I have nominated myself to run this years Derby Race for our Pack and wanted to get some opinions on how the race has been run in the past. Last year was my boys first Pinewood Derby and I thought it seemed fair. After reading some of the posts here, I'm not so sure.

We have ~30 boy in the pack and race on a 2- lane track with a Fast Track Timer. As far as awards go, we recognize the top 6 in the pack (5 racers and 1 alternate) that move on to the District Race. The race method used is double elimination. However, the one difference is that each heat consists of two races. The two cars race once and then alternate lanes. In order to win the heat, the car must win in both lanes. If each car wins one race, they both move on as though they have one the heat.

What are you thoughts on this method and what might you do differently?

[Stan Pope]

We have ~30 boy in the pack and race on a 2- lane track with a Fast Track Timer. As far as awards go, we recognize the top 6 in the pack (5 racers and 1 alternate) that move on to the District Race. The race method used is double elimination. However, the one difference is that each heat consists of two races. The two cars race once and then alternate lanes. In order to win the heat, the car must win in both lanes. If each car wins one race, they both move on as though they have one the heat.

Welcome aboard, and congratulations!

What is the basis for selecting the Top 5 + 1? Times?

Double Elim alone is notoriously poor for places 3, 4, 5, ...

[Pack 187]

Although I said we have a Fast Track Timer, it has only been used for taking the human error out of judging wins and losses. Therefore, the top 6 are decided by the double elimination method.

[Stan Pope]

Okay, I understand.

We gotta do an indepth analysis of the "quirK" of "elim point only if lose both heats on alternating lane. It improves the accuracy for 3, maybe.

"Quintuple (or sextuple) elim - no chart" without the alternating lane speeds up the process and adds more opponents. Lane equity dealt with by lane draw. Cory Young produced some neat software for accuracy evaluation for these schemes.

I don't think that it analyzes the alternating lane variation (at least, the version that I have doesn't), so you may have to do that analysis yourself.

Since it takes 5 or 6 losses to get bailed, then the liklihood of being unlucky enough to draw the two fastest cars early in the running no longer affects the racers.

If your group is "dead set" on using the alternating lanes approach, it can be done wtih quad-elim method as well and use the same criteria for "winning".

[FRANKLIN WHALEY]

We have a two lane track and timer. But we use the points system for determining the finish orders. Each car in the class 1st -3rd grade and 4th-6th grade have to race every car in their class. We alternate lanes with each car, so both cars get a run in the so called fastest lane. If each car wins a race in the fast lane, the tie breaker is determined by fastest time. Each car would get a point for the race it won. Then the car with the fastest time would recieve the tie breaker point. A total of points is done at the end as to keep the racers interest high. With this method, finding the fastest cars is fool proof. We have about thirty boys, but they are divided into two groups according to age. We have a 1st-3rd in each group,and a grand champion race for the winners.

[Stan Pope]

The method rewards the losing car for his heat win. That is a good addition to the double round robin format.

This is a good use of a timer! If Car A wins the first heat (by 7 inches) and Car B wins the second heat (by 9 inches), the audience should be able to see that Car B should win the tie break on time. If you withhold the points info from the audience, then they can't validate the scoring.

I disagree with withholding scoring info from the audience. They deserve to know how the races are called and who was awarded the points. Besides, I relied on the audience to catch my scoring errors when I was the scorekeeper! (Yes, I recall making two such scoring errors over the years. The alert audience got me back on track quickly!)

In the above example, if Car A wins the tie break, then something is probably broken, and the audience should properly call the scoring to task.

[FRANKLIN WHALEY]

Stan, We don't withhold who won that particular tie-breaker point. The audience and boys will know who won that race. Just the final totals on the chart are done after all races are complete. We have two groups,so we wait until both are completely finished before giving away the results. Sorry I didn't make that clear! I've looked at several methods, and for a small group of thirty or less ,I don't think there is a better method. All the boys get the same number of races. And in the end the fastest cars will be reveiled.

[Stan Pope]

Sounds good, Franklin.

Since you are running the two heats on alternating lanes consecutively, you can use the method even without a timer by noting the length of winning margin. Yes, it might get difficult to distinguish a 1/8" vs a 1/16" winning margins or 5" vs 5-1/4" winning margins, but those are (I think) unusual conditions. Those could be called "unresolvable ties" and award each car the full score.

[FRANKLIN WHALEY]

Before we got the timer, we flipped a coin for lane choice and had a tie-breaker race. But the loser of the coin toss was at a disadvantage. So we feel the faster times of these two cars is the best way to settle the tie. Our finish line judges were so indecisive they would often call for a re-run in the same lanes because they couldn't determine a winner. That's why we bought the electronic finish line judge with timer.

[Stan Pope]

Before we got the timer, we flipped a coin for lane choice and had a tie-breaker race. But the loser of the coin toss was at a disadvantage.

My grandson's council races are run that way ... but without the coin flip. (Each "heat" is best two out of three runs, alternating lanes, starter decides which lanes to put cars in.) I cringe every time I see it run! The winning strategy there is to be decisively faster than the other cars!

Our finish line judges were so indecisive they would often call for a re-run in the same lanes because they couldn't determine a winner. That's why we bought the electronic finish line judge with timer.

Judging by eye is a learned skill. There are teachable techniques to do it with accuracy and consistency. There are also physical limitations that may prevent even the most fair-minded person from doing the job ... for instance, vision defects regarding straight lines or inability to move the head and body smoothly to follow the cars due to arthritis.

If an indecisive judge can't call races, expecting them to compare winning margin for successive heats would be a waste of time! But, I think many judges could do it well. I'd use a crib sheet to mark my observation of the winning margin immediately after each heat, then compare the marks.