Speed Methods

Secrets, tips, tools, design considerations, materials, the "science" behind it all, and other topics related to building the cars and semi-trucks.
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thecapotc
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Speed Methods

Post by thecapotc »

Hey all,

I've quickly browsed through the construction topics from all 53 pages and think I have a pretty comprehensive list of the different methods mentioned/used for speed.

I realize some may serve the same purpose based on rules allowances but that's ok. I am trying to dig into each individually and then begin determining which ones to use as variables for some trial builds this summer.

I'll post in separate lists within this topic since I found about 40 of them. If there are any I've missed please let me know.

Thanks,
C2


To start, here's the list of wheel preps I came across ...

General
  • Bore to Tread concentricity / runout / trueing / etc.
    Lathe turning
    Lightening - w\out lathe
Bore Preparations
  • Smoothing
    Threading
    Undercutting
    Burnishing
    Polishing
    Bushings/Bearings
    Waxes
Tread / Rim / Hub Preparations
  • Inner hub coning
    Tread polishig
    Inner rim polishing
    Razor / thinned wheels
    Inside out wheel mounting
Last edited by thecapotc on Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
thecapotc
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Re: Speed Methods

Post by thecapotc »

Continuing with axles, body, etc. ...

Axle Preparations
  • Polishing
    Grooving
    Straightening
    Glueing in place
    Needle axles
    Tapered heads
    Small diameter (from stock axles)
Lubrication
  • Wheels
    Axles
    Graphite
    Oil
    Dry Film spray
Car / Body Preparations
  • Alignment
    • Toe
      Camber
      Wide track
      Shimming
      Rail Rider
      Wheel to body gap
      3-wheeler
    Body
    • Aerodynamic design
      Block baking
      Nose / starter contact (i.e. cheater bars)
      Weight insulation
      Wood mass
      "Suspension" designs
      Center of Mass
      Wheel base
If there's anything I missed or anything I should add let me know, I'm hoping to consolidate/start reviewing/digging into these this weekend.

Thanks again,

C2
resophonic racing
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Re: Speed Methods

Post by resophonic racing »

These are some great tips posted by W Racing on another forum:

Derby time is aproaching so here are some tips for 2012. Hopefully others will pitch in with their favorite tips.

Properly drilled holes are the foundation of a fast car. Use the Silver Bullet.

READ and understand the rules of the race.

Ask the race officials if you have questions... (Get answers in writting if possible)

Determine the following:

Can I:

Drill holes or do I need to use slots (Holes are better, use The Block to drill them.)

If I can drill holes can I extend the wheel base (Extended faster)

Can I use any axles or only BSA axles (Most races will require BSA axles). [no advertising for this vendor] axles are the fastest available if your rules allow them...

Can I taper the heads of the axles? This is a rule that some folks will cheat on by tapering 1-2 degrees. Not enforcable and not a good rule... However if you have the rule make sure your axles heads are not tapered.... (rare rule fortunately)

Can I raise a front wheel (3 wheels touching) recomended

ADVANCED QUESTIONS:

Can I cant rear wheels?

Can I railride (Run the rail ;D).

Maybe too advanced. Just ask if it is allowed. You can make a fast car without these.... However faster car if you can do them...

TIPS:

ALIGNMENT IS KEY TO WINNING:

If you can drill axle holes. Drill them perfect. This is the foundation of the car. and the foundation of your alignment.

The Silver Bullet allows you to drill perfect holes...

EXCESS WOOD: Cars with excess wood make it harder to get the COM right. Cars in the 0.6 - 1.2 ounce range work best. Good to have 3.5 ounces of concentrated weight if you can get it. (Lighter cars will work as well... However it is not necessary and BSA cars often run with brutal stop sections so the cars need to be a bit robust)

CAR NOSE:

You should have a 1/2 flat area on the center front of your car for the starting pin and for the finish line.


If you can extend the wheel base do so...

Rear axle back as far as possible 5/8. Front axle 7/8 back to protect against rough BSA stop sections.

If you can not extend the wheel base can you chop the rear 1/4 inch of the block off and glue to the front? Ask the race folks...

Folks sweat over COM...

Not as important as alignment. If this is your first car start at 3/4"

Build a test car to get the COM correct. Weight should be all in one place near the rear axle...

Most people make the mistake of chasing a certain COM and adding weight all over the car. Dont do this...

Once you get a working design prototype car with correct COM. Start making the real car...

If money allows use Tungsten Disc or tungsten cubes.

Place the weight near or around the rear axle.

FOR BSA races be careful to not cut the axles on your car unless the race officials allow it. Even then keep the tips of the axles as proof.

Allow 3 weeks to build car if possible.

Father / son takes more time to mesh schedules. Paint two weeks before race if possible...

Skip paint on bottom of car to save time...

Prep an extra wheel and axle or two for a crash on race day...

Use [no advertising for this vendor] graphite and polish kit. Oil DVD if allowed.

If you railride (Run the rail ;D) Have fun. Post questions. No one will know who you are :-)
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sporty
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Re: Speed Methods

Post by sporty »

I think what you got there is a good list. Im not sure if you know how or what ways you will be testing. Are you planning on testing each area ? and the sub variables to them ?

I think you will indeed be very busy, If you are to test and persue all of what you have mentioned. I think it took me years to look and try all of that and Im not sure I really was able to try and do all of that.

You have a large task ahead of you and I hope no matter how far you get into or are able to test and try all of that. Not for sure what reason to do so, if outside of your rules or what equipment you have and will be using.

But i think you will find yourself very busy and I hope you learn allot and enjoy the many different options and ways that you can do, depending on your rules or if this is just a overall summary report of something for a book you are doing.

I would imagine several note books filled with detailed information and data, to just be able to write it all down for comparisons.

I truly look forward to some day reading this or what your comments and over view will be in the end.

Sporty
Topspin.D
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Re: Speed Methods

Post by Topspin.D »

A properly drilled block is the foundation as mentioned above and makes alignment must easier/faster.

One thing not mentioned is using waxes as part of bore prep. That will result in more speed.
thecapotc
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Re: Speed Methods

Post by thecapotc »

Sporty,

I figured I'd research all the areas first, that way the no-brainers like lube is better than no lube could be sorted out quickly. I'm also hoping that searching around the site and dredging up some dormant knowledge from college will help determine when a borderline idea is worth testing. On top of that is the issue of reviewing the rules we use and my budget.

Then I'm going to cut the list down quite a bit. I love digging into problems and spending time doing research, but mostly when I'm spending a customer's money instead of my own. Right now I'm just doing my due diligence to ensure there isn't something I missed before cutting the list down to a manageable size.

I haven't done a full blown DOE in about two years so I'll need to go review that, unfortunately I do remember that your first DOE is exactly that. The first of many. Luckily I have access to Minitab at work so I can run the correlation test on multiple combined data sets, so that theoretically I could test two or three variables at once.

Honestly I haven't thought about testing yet because I've learned that before you test you better know what you're going after. Once I have everything pared down I'll figure the testing out, but for now I am going to assume testing will involve many cars/axles/wheels and a track. A track that I don't yet own or have access to. I'm pretty sure my wife will understand a track in the middle of the house. If not I have a garage, where I can probably put both the track and a bed.

I figure the task is going to be bigger than I imagined, but I have lots of time since my oldest still has 5 years of AWANA racing, and my youngest won't even start for 3 years. If my math is correct I should have 9 or 10 years to keep digging. I also figure that I have free labor and data collection since we homeschool and I think quite a few science projects could come out of all these topics.

Thanks for the support,

C2
thecapotc
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Re: Speed Methods

Post by thecapotc »

Topspin,

Thanks for mentioning wax, I've added to the list in the original post.

C2
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