scroll saw topic.

Secrets, tips, tools, design considerations, materials, the "science" behind it all, and other topics related to building the cars and semi-trucks.
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whodathunkit
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scroll saw topic.

Post by whodathunkit »

If you are just getting started into the hobby of pinewood derby.
And you are looking at scroll saws as a way to cut patterned design cars from the pinewood derby books that have internal cuts out in there design
or to a design of your very own. Or by chance you've just purchased a scroll saw.. or are unfamiliar with them but looking to get one to get started.
Image
Image

I fell there is a need for this topic just based off some of the scroll saw questions that have been ask to me on the site lately!
Because I was once new to the hobby of scroll sawing my self .. so with that said I'm going to shift my focus on to this topic.
A little about my self and my scroll sawing hobby.. I've been scroll sawing for a little over 20 years now and I'm some what self taught.
I started out in my Grandads workshop.. then on to my Fathers Sears walking beam scroll saw.. and my passion for scroll sawing & woodworking took off from there.

But it is my hopes with what I'm going to share here .. that it will help you and your child to have a pleasant experience with using a scroll saw
as you enter into the pinewood derby , and or wood working and scroll sawing hobbies.

For starters new into scroll sawing I don't recommend paying a lot for a new scroll saw when there are many models for less that will make grate new starter saws.
And for the time to time projects with the short cutting sections. ( hours spent cutting with the saw)

You probably don't want to pay a lot and buy the most expensive equipment when your getting started in any hobby!
So look at it this way once your hooked you can always up-grade. from a starter saw to a mid-level or higher end saw.

But as with any piece of scroll saw equipment you buy the more features the saw has the more the price go's up.

So with that in mind when your looking to purchase a scroll saw.. keep a mind set that some of the features can be added to the saw later
when your tempted to go with the model that is more expensive.

Some of the features that can be added later are accessories to your saw like a light source, magnifying glass, saw stand, and on/off foot peddle controls,
and better blade chucks.

Some buying advise that I my self would look for in a starter saw would be the controls on the saw because you'll be using them a lot !
Are the on/off & tension controls in a safe spot and easy to reach.

Variable speed control models are in my opinion a good option to have.. because you'll have a hard time adding that feature to your saw later.
And when you are new to scroll sawing you'll want a saw you can control by slowing it down for better control over your work!
When you fell your ready to cut at a faster pace and feed rate you'll have away to speed the saw up.

Probably one of the most important decisions to make when buying a scroll saw is on the blade type the saw uses.
Some models use pin-end blades only, or the reg flat blade only or both blade types.
Here's an example of the two blade types and pilot hole sizes needed to thread the blade.
Image
Now here's that important decision you have to make and that's finding one that will allow you easy blade changes for the blade types or one you can work with
for the type of work you'll be doing most with the saw.
I say this because there are some models that have very cumbersome blade chucks to where the blades are some what of a pain to change out.
To me this only leads to a bad experience with using the scroll saw if you are having a hard time changing blades out.
Pinned end blades are grate for large internal cut outs.. but short lived because of the 3/16" pilot hole size needed to thread the blade.
For much more detail work where small internal cuts are needed the straight/flat end or spiral blades are used most for this purpose.

From there look at the table sizes and shapes the throat plates they use or into the way they tilt... some will tilt more to the left.. some left and right..
and then on some of the higher end scroll saw models only the arms tilt while the table stays flat..

( Need to turn your scroll saw into a sander as well ? )
For Scroll saws with the large plastic throat plates covers there are scroll sanders on the market as well for pin end and plain end type saws.
pin end type: with 1/4'' and 1/2'' options.
Image
plain end type with 1/4'' and 1/2'' options.
Image
These are offered by Olson at..https://www.olsonsaw.net/cat/scroll-saw ... llsanders/
Pegas type Scroll sanders at Bearwood.. https://www.bearwood.com/product5880.html


Most scroll saws can cut up to 2" with the hold down removed and work table flat in some cases.
For most scroll saw hobbies the 18'' model will handle most all the saw jobs. larger model saws larger projects!

Well that's it for tonight.. as I will be back with some photos showing some scroll saw's that I have in my workshop.
That I'm hoping will show you just how hard it can be to change blades on some different models.
From there I'll get into sharing different blade types and talk about there use's.
Last edited by whodathunkit on Fri Jul 28, 2023 5:10 pm, edited 21 times in total.
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Vitamin K
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Re: scroll saw topic.

Post by Vitamin K »

Good topic, Whoda! :thumbup:

I will definitely be watching for updates and more great information to glean!
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Re: scroll saw topic.

Post by whodathunkit »

Thanks VK !
I'm also going to touch on how vibration and noise in a scroll saw can hinder your cuts and your hands.
There are lots of reasons the wood could be jumping while sawing.. some a simple as saw is not bolted down and has vibration.
Or the hold down foot is not used.. To the blades sizes and or wood thickness . or to worn out blades .. even to blades installed wrong.

EDIT :
I have since found a very good video about scroll saw troubleshooting that go's into more details.. ( For Wood Jumping!)
That I have linked on page 2 of this topic.
Last edited by whodathunkit on Sat Apr 29, 2023 6:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: scroll saw topic.

Post by whodathunkit »

Okay last night I left off talking about table tops and the different types!
When buying, pay attention to the following features: there shapes round , rectangular, and so on the size, or center openings, blade slots
for ease of blade installation. ( On some saws the top arm lifts up for threading the blade ) & there abilities for the table to tilt either direction.
Other important considerations include the accuracy of the tilting scale, the smoothness or ease of adjustment & clamp quality.
So at best pay attention to the design & engineering quality when making your pick for a scroll saw..
On some saws only the table tilts.. some the table stays flat and the arms tilt.
Check the side play of the arms .. if you can power up the saw look to see if the operation of the blade is a blur or a crisp vertical line.
Pay attention to the saw vibration.. some saws are very loud and must be bolted down to a heavy workbench or stand.. otherwise they will bounce all over.
Some saws will run very quietly and smoothly that you can actually balance a coin on it's edge on the table top.
The noise levels and saw dust particles can affect you health and comfort during extended periods of saw use.. P.P.E. here is a must for your hearing, eyes, and lungs !

I myself sometimes find the large table tops a disadvantage.. since I seldom use the back it any way!
I find my self storing the unneeded pieces on it which get in the way when I need to swing the work.

Here is a pic of 1940 model sears craftsman scroll saw it's one of the oldest scroll saws that I have however it dose not get used much.
(Some people would call this saw a jig saw as well!)
Image
It's a Rigid-arm model that is very heavy and made of cast and tubular overarm that is stationary.
The only visible movement is the blade going up and down on a spring loaded plunger that is located in the upper arm.
With rigid arm saws the down stroke is the power stroke and the up stoke is produced by the spring action.
Image
Okay you are not going to find this type of scroll saw on the market today! but from time to time some one will have one to sale.
The drive system of the rigid-arm machine by virtue of its design is subject to sudden loading and unloading of the blade tension during each stroke.
In other words the tension is not consistently the same throughout the entire stroke.
If by chance the feeding pressure or saw dust clogging the upper spring does not pull the blade up after the down stroke.
The blade is too flexible as it is pushed upward by the drive system of the machine.
This situation, combined with feeding pressures places strain on the blade and the result is premature breakage to the blade.
So to prevent this from happening.. reduce stock thickness or use stiffer and wider blades..
however this will limit the sharpness of a turn that can be made and the capability of making intricate cuts in thicker material.
So in short, the disadvantages of rigid-arm saws well outweigh there advantages!
However it's a neat saw to show off here on the topic.. so I thought id show it's workings and talk about it!
I would question why one would purchase this type of machine for home or professional use today.
Why do I have one because it was passed on to me from my Grandfather and fun to get it up and working once more.

Next up Constant tension saws that you will find on the market today!
Constant tension saws include the C-arm/frame and the parallel-arm types for example.
Pic's of two different c-arm models:
Image
Image
Image
Image
Sorry I don't have a parallel arm with the tension control in the back for an example.
Image
From the drawing examples above you'll see the doted lines showing the movement action of the arms and blade movement.
Throughout the stroke the blade always maintains exactly the same tension on the up stroke as it does on the down stroke.
The advantages of constant-tension saws include minimal blade breakage & the capability to cut with much thinner blades.
This allows you to make incredibly sharp turns and saw accurate, highly detailed intricate designs in thick as well thin woods.
As the blade reciprocates it enters slightly into the work on the down stroke & then backs away slightly on the upwards movement.

The cutting action of constant-tension saws is much different from the rigid arm saw. ( posted first photo.)
On the rigid arm saw the saw blade stays perfectly vertical in just one spot, moving up and down only with in its own space.
With constant-tension saws the blade generally moves slightly forward into the wood on the up stroke, or vise versa.
The blade can also have a "mixed action" movement.
The blade motion of constant-tension saws does several important things.. it helps with better saw dust removal when fine blades are used.
Which means cooler cutting & no burning of the cut since less heat is generated will stay sharp and don't brake as often.

Ok VK, if looking about hold tight I'm getting to your lifting problem!
Some of blades works against the walls or sides of the saw kerf; the results are extremely smoothly cut surfaces that need no or little sanding.
The blade "rasps" away ridges on the previously cut surface as it moves into and out of the new wood during the reciprocating movement.
Less pressure is required to hold down the work piece if the blade backs off on the up stroke, which is when the work normally tends to lift on the
rigid arm saws.

Okay time for a break as I'll be back to talk about C-arm constant-tension saws and parallel-arm tension saws.
Last edited by whodathunkit on Sun Jun 25, 2023 6:56 pm, edited 8 times in total.
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scroll saw topic.

Post by whodathunkit »

C-arm constant-tension saws.. these saws are are tensioned "up front".
This is an advantage because you don't have to reach all the way to the back of the machine where most all parallel-arm saw are tensioned.
The primary disadvantage of a c-arm saw design is the way the blade travels the blade tips backwards on the up stroke.
On some models the pivot point is more centrally located this means that when cutting the blade tips slightly more forward then vertical
at the completion of the down stroke.
The tipping in and out of the vertical plane creates some problems when sawing along sharp irregular curves in thicker wood.
It's likely that the curved cuts will not be square, or as true as when making straight line cuts in the same material and same saw.

Parallel-arm constant-tension saws.. these saws are regarded by most scroll saw authorities as being the best overall at least in design theory.
The major advantage of true parallelogram saws is that the blade remains vertical throughout the total stroke.
Although the blade moves slightly into the cut on the down ward stroke & moves slightly back on the up stroke this design seems to produce
the smoothest & truest cuts with the least blade breakage. so in any case a constant feed rate is important for smooth cuts & blade life.

Now for the parallel arm link system saw that are on the higher end models ..
sorry my drawing is not the best of this system workings or for the movement of the blade.
The cutting action of the blade is also vertical throughout the total stroke .. with less vibration in the saws movement and workings.
Image
Image

I hope with what iv shared in the photos above that it gives some example's of the scroll saw types to those who are unfamiliar with scroll saws.
And your probably tired of reading the babbling on.. on the types!

So let's look at a 1994 16'' Delta Model 40-560 2 speed scroll saw and it's blade clamping system remember how I said some models have very hard to change blade features.
Image
Back in 1994 this saw had what was called.. the quickset blade changing feature.
Image
There are two types of clamping systems on scroll saws tooled and tool less.
Tooled meaning a tool is used to change blades .. tool less meaning no tools have to be used just a thumb screw or a knob.
For this model it use's reg flat blades here's a pic of the top chuck showing a tool less chuck clamping system the small round black lever pushes to the right to squeeze and clamp the blade.
And a tool is used for the bottom chuck clamping system.
Image
And you can see the throat plate in the table.. to get a better view of the bottom chuck while changing the blade the throat plate is removed.
Image
And now the bottom blade chuck.
Image
And the tool that is used for changing the blade in the lower chuck.
Image
Image
Changing blades with this system is not bad or hard to do.
You'll probably find this tooled clamping systems.. more so in the older scroll saws then you will in the saws offered at retail stores.
However saw's on the market still will have some type of blade chuck systems that use's a tool.. some toolless.
A view of where the on/off and two speed controls are located.. and the way the table tilts on this model.
Image
Image

Some pic's of my first Dremel 1800 scroll saw...
However as kid I started out using my fathers sears walking beam model.
On the sears walking beam model only the upper and lower arms tilted as the work table stayed flat.
Here is a link to a web site showing a lot more examples of scroll saws in the much smaller hobby size to larger saws in a large collection.
you'll also see the craftsman walking beam 18 model in the link at the very bottom of the first page.
http://www.scrollsaws.com/SawCollection/SawsBench.htm

The Dremel 1800 scroll saw I bought for my self.
Image
On the Dremel saw.. the controls are up front and easy to get to along with the variable speed.
Image
The dust covers over the switches can make them hard to turn on or off.
pic's of the blade chucks first the top and then bottom for this model.. will use both styles of blades and a tool less clamping system.
Image
Note the table top throat plate.. these can be problematic for catching on your work.
In this pic you'll see the lower chuck is set back inside a cover and there is a port for a dust collector or shop vac.
Image
Table tilt for this saw is to the left.
Image
plus you see it also has disk sander feature if can be took off and the Dremel flex shaft installed to it as well.

And then some pic's of a DeWalt 788 type 2 model the blade chucks and tool less system this model uses the reg flat blades only.
Top chuck :Image
Bottom chuck:Image
All the controls are up front as well.
Image
table tilts left and right.
Image
Image
No table top throat plate:
Image

well that's all for now I'll get to the blades types soon.
Last edited by whodathunkit on Thu Jun 01, 2023 8:47 am, edited 17 times in total.
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Re: scroll saw topic.

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Some examples of some scroll saw blade that I cut out larger for showing the blade types and different tooth styles.
Image

The only blade type I can think of that has no top or bottom to the blade.. is the Crown tooth blade as this blade type has a two way cutting action.
So when the cutting teeth dull out.. this blade can be turned over for a fresh new set of cutting teeth.
( 3rd blade example down in the image.)

Note: all scroll saw blades cut with the teeth pointed down!
The reverse tooth blades will have teeth that point down followed by a gap then teeth pointed up.
The top example blade shows a pin end style.. hope you can see the dowel rod used in the end for the example of this type!
The pilot hole size needed for pin end blades to pass threw is 3/16"
For the pin end blades there made in a skip tooth, reg tooth and a hook tooth.. for the tooth styles.
There will also be no uni numbers on the blade sizes.. just the teeth per inch ( TPI ) for example the hook tooth style will have 7 teeth per inch.
And in the skip tooth style you'll have teeth per inch sizes ranging from 18.5, & 9/5, being a heavy duty widely-spaced set teeth for fast cutting.
In the reg tooth style 10, 15, 20, 25, teeth per inch.
From this if you count the examples given for teeth per inch.. you will see that there is only 7 blades to chose from in the pin end style blades.
So the pin end blades are kind of short lived if you are looking to really get into scroll sawing and fret work that has much smaller details and tighter turns.

Now when you get into the reg flat blade (pinless types) the tooth styles seen from the 2nd blade and down in the photo example.
You'll have lots of blade choices! However in the examples I'm leaving out a two blade types examples
like the (PGT) precision ground tooth blades as they are not recommended for beginners.
And the flat end spiral blade as these are like the regular spiral blade but with flat ends.. this blade type will come in two sizes
a #2 with 41 teeth per inch.. and a #4 with 36 teeth per inch these are offered for easier blade installation.

For all the rest of the blade sizes depending on the blade manufacture and tooth styles you'll find ranges in size's from 2/0, 3/0 being the smallest sizes and 12 being the largest.
for all these blades use lower numbers for thinner stock and higher numbers for thicker stock.

Standard -tooth blades: the teeth are all the same size and distance apart there are both metal-cutting & wood cutting blades.

Skip- tooth blades: are similar to the standard tooth but every other tooth is missing.. the space in between teeth is much wider, witch keeps the blade cooler and allows the saw
to clear out more saw dust. (There also good blades for beginners because they cut smoothy and quick.

Reverse Skip- tooth blades: are the same as the skip tooth except the last few bottom teeth point upward to help prevent splintering or tare -out on the bottom side of the work.
When installing or using this blade type you'll want to be sure the reverse teeth are slightly above the top of the cutting table with the saw at it's highest stroke position.

Double-tooth blades: are similar to the skip tooth blades but have a larger space between two set of teeth.. they will cut slightly slower but clear out the saw dust and leave a smooth cut.

Crown -tooth blades: these blades have teeth shaped like a crown with space between each tooth... they are reversible- there is no upside down! They will cut slower then other blades..
but do there best cutting in plastic or acrylic.

Precision -ground blades: are skip-tooth blades with smaller teeth that have been ground to shape as opposed to filed.. they are sharper, and cut a straighter line, and leave a very smooth
surface. ( These blades tend to cut aggressively, so beginners may have trouble using them!)

Spiral blades: with teeth all the way around.. saw in all directions with 360* cutting capability so there is no need to turn or rotate the work piece.
(Popular for portrait-style cutting or cutting projects that are to large to be rotated in the saw.) The width of the cut is grater and the cut is rougher..
They do not allow you to cut tight, sharp corners.

Scroll sawing in general is a practice based off of user preferences on blades and techniques in cutting..
what works for someone else make not work for you for blade sizes, TPI or tooth types in your projects.

For example if you ask three people who use scroll saws what blades sizes, TPI or tooth style they use in soft wood 1' thick your likely to get three different answers.

For example: I would chose a blade in the size range #5 - #9 in the reverse-tooth. If I needed a very smooth finish to the cut for the project.. I would chose a blade with lots of teeth per inch.
When it comes to TPI ( Teeth per inch ) on the scroll saw blades.. the more TPI the blade has.. the finer finish it will have on the cut.
Plus it will also have a slower feed rate that it can cut the wood at.

Less teeth per inch on the scroll saw blade:
The faster speed rate it can cut the wood.. ( faster feed rate ) with a less desirable rougher finish to the cut.

There are also scroll saw blade charts on the web from scroll saw blade manufactures as well that can help you with blade selection for your cutting needs:
https://www.olsonsaw.net/wp-content/upl ... rt-WEB.pdf
https://www.bearwood.com/media/Pegas-Sc ... Supply.pdf

Here's a web link to find the many different blade manufactures and retailers.
https://scrollsawnewb.com/scroll-saw-bl ... retailers/

Along with the Shark Tooth brand scroll saw blades found in the link below:
https://www.thewinfieldcollection.com/c ... Saw_Blades
These blades are my go to in the ultra-reverse type.
Image

Hope this helps with blade choices and happy scrolling with your pinewood derby car projects!
Last edited by whodathunkit on Sat Aug 26, 2023 5:54 pm, edited 23 times in total.
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Re: RE: Re: scroll saw topic.

Post by derbypain »

whodathunkit wrote:Some examples of some scroll saw blade that I cut out larger to showing the blade types.. and different tooth styles.
Image
The top example blade shows a pin end style.. hope you can see the dowel rod used in the end for the example of this type!
The pilot hole size needed for pin end blades to pass threw is 3/16"
For the pin end blades there made in a skip tooth, reg tooth and a hook tooth.. for the tooth styles.
There will also be no uni numbers on the blade sizes.. just the teeth per inch.. for example the hook tooth style will have 7 teeth per inch.
And in the skip tooth style you'll have teeth per inch sizes ranging from 18.5, & 9/5, being a heavy duty widely-spaced set teeth for fast cutting.
In the reg tooth style 10, 15, 20, 25, teeth per inch.
From this if you count the examples given for teeth per inch.. you will see that there is only 7 blades to chose from in the pin end style blades.
So these blades are kinda short lived if your looking to really get into scroll sawing and work that has smaller detail.

Now when you get into the reg flat blade types and tooth styles seen from the 2nd blade and down in the photo example.
You'll have lots of blade choices! However in the examples i'm leaving out a two blade types examples
like the (PGT) precision ground tooth blades as they are not recommended for beginners.
And the flat end spiral blade as these are like the regular spiral blade but with flat ends..this blade type will come in two sizes
a #2 with 41 teeth per inch.. and a #4 with 36 teeth per inch these are offered for easier blade installation.

For all the rest of the blade sizes depending on the tooth styles you'll find ranges in size's from 3/0 being the smallest and 12 being the largest.
for all these blades use lower numbers for thinner stock and higher numbers for thicker stock.

Skip tooth blades will cut cold rolled steel,copper,brass,aluminum sheet and bronze. Soft metal up to 1/8'' thick in a single sheet or several thin sheets.
Cut at slower speeds though!
Reverse tooth blades will help eliminate under side tare out of the work.
Double tooth blades will cut plastic.. same for the crown tooth.
Spiral blades saw in all directions with 360* cutting capability so there is no need to turn the work piece.

Scroll sawing in general is a practice based off of user preferences on blades and techniques in cutting..
what works for someone else make not work for you for blade sizes or tooth types in your projects.
For example if you ask three people who use scroll saws what blades sizes they use on different size woods your likely to get three different answers.

Hope this helps and happy scrolling with your pinewood derby car projects!
All I can say is wow Whoda! You are an encyclopedia of scrolling knowledge. Thanks so much for this thread and your responses on the other... I haven't made it through all the details of this last post but thanks in advance.

Sent from my Note 5 using Tapatalk
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scroll saw topic.

Post by whodathunkit »

Your welcome derbypain!
Almost forget to share a photo of some foot peddle control types.
Image
On the left side is an on/off peddle switch.. the right is a variable speed foot peddle.
I have tried to use the variable speed feature on saws with out variable speed.. with out any luck the motor just hum's in- tell the peddle is fully pressed down.

EDIT:
Foot peddle control's.
For my personal preference they would be my #1 must have accessory. ( for starting and stopping scroll saw's.) Safety Reasons.
You will not have to lift a hand of the work piece or even take you're eyes off the work piece while the saw is running..
to find the power switch on the saw to kill the power when a blade breaks.. or even if the work is jumping and gets out of control.
Just lift your foot off the control peddle when the saw stops .. then reach out to power off the main switch on the saw.

The 2nd accessory would be a magnifying / work light.

Scroll saw sold in the United States in stores will have the hold down foot. Those sold out of the country will not have them. Just a little info on the hold downs.
Last edited by whodathunkit on Sun Apr 30, 2023 9:45 am, edited 7 times in total.
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Re: scroll saw topic.

Post by davet »

Perfectly timed as I'm now looking into these. I'll have to re-read this thread and really study your pics to get a handle on this. Thanks.
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Re: scroll saw topic.

Post by whodathunkit »

Thank's devet!
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scroll saw topic.

Post by whodathunkit »

Some more scrolling tips I'll pass along to make it easy for blade changes as to what's the tooth direction or to even color coding the blade types.
Is some blades come in packs that are bundled & wrapped in wire .. Look at the tooth direction of the blades before unwinding the wire..
to make sure the teeth are pointed down on the blades.. and then paint the top end of the bundle .
The blade always go's in the the saw with the painted end up and the tooth direction pointed down!
On the Olson brand scroll saw blade packs seen in the image below.. there blade packs are color coded for the different saw blade types also.
Image
Spiral tooth- Green.
Skip tooth - Blue.
Reverse tooth- Orange.
Double tooth- Violet Purple
Thick wood blades -Pink
Crown tooth blades - Yellow.
(The Crown tooth blades have a two way cutting action so there is no top or bottom to this blade type.)
Plus the crown tooth blade can be turned over for a fresh new set of teeth.
On the reverse tooth type blades you'll want to keep at least 1 to 2 of reverse teeth above the table while cutting to have them working there best.

You can use the colors on the Olson blade packs.. as a quick identification of the tooth direction or the different blade types.
Stick with there color code blade type identifier while painting the blades top's and/or blade storage holders.
For the Olson Mach speed blade type blades I use red and black bands to identify them as there older paper backed packs were red and black striped.
Image

TO give you an idea of what a color coded system on the Olson scroll saw blades in my blade storge racks look like.. I used a magic marker .
And stuck a small paper inside the tubes identifying blade type.. Also on the paper I marked the type, size info and so on.
Image
The Olson Mach speed blades can be seen in the left hand storage rack back row to the right hand side.
Black labels seen in front are Shark tooth ultra reverse brand blades .. plus I have and use Flying Dutchman brand blades as well in the center plastic rack on back 2 rows.

I'll share some links on where you can go to find the pattern make the wooden storage rack with link to the tubes .. and the clear plastic one below.


Most smaller blades types with very heavy usage in thick woods ( or when pushing the wood to cut.. ( feed rate)
will only last.. for about 30 to 60 minutes give or take.. before they become dull or they brake from heat.
You'll also find that some blades from the same bundle and type will seem to cut better then others do also when new.
( this is due to the stamping and how they are made!)

For applying patterns:
Put painters masking tape down on the wood first.. then use an adhesive spray glue on the back side of your paper pattern sticking it down on the masked off work.. and then put some type of a clear packing tape over the top of the pattern .. this helps with holding your pattern down on to the work.. and it also makes for a grate blade lube for the blade while cutting.
And then clean up of the work and removal of the pattern simple.

For removing burs on the back side of the blades or for rounding over the back side of the blade to making tighter turns in thick woods with the larger size blades:
Is to install the blade.. power up the saw with it running .. use a file to remove the burs or round over the back side of the blade.
Image
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I use the Eze-lap diamond hone/stone files:
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https://eze-lap.com/products/diamond-hone-stone/


When your blades are stored for long periods of time in the open they will also tend to rust as well..to prevent it a light coat of oil or WD40 will help prevent rusting.
If you are really picky about oils and getting them on your wood work.. use a good wax paper to wrap them up in.

For blade storage rack Ideas with 6 inch long test tubes Here's an idea from Steve Good that's a free down load !
https://scrollsawworkshop.blogspot.com/ ... n.html?m=1
One I made from the link above along with the tubes also linked:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004N ... 9f1937387a
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Then one from PS Woods:
https://www.pswood.com/blade-storage/
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Note: you can also use the papers that come with the blade packs to keep track of what blades are what.
Even 2 pill bottles with a two-way cap and center removed make for good blade storage.
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To keep the table top from rusting and make the wood slide and turn easy:
Use a non- silicone based paste wax and from time to time Pledge furniture polish.
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Last edited by whodathunkit on Thu Jul 06, 2023 9:49 pm, edited 32 times in total.
What type of automobile can be spelled the same forwards & backwards?
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FatSebastian
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Re: scroll saw topic.

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I am bumping this older topic with the hopes that Whoda can repair his tinypic image links. Some of his recent builds have reminded me that I need to start shopping for a new scroll saw!
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whodathunkit
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Re: scroll saw topic.

Post by whodathunkit »

FatSebastian wrote: Thu Mar 23, 2023 4:52 pm I am bumping this older topic with the hopes that Whoda can repair his tinypic image links. Some of his recent builds have reminded me that I need to start shopping for a new scroll saw!
Boy FS , you really had me cranking on my old Buster Brown scroll saw .. the photo's are changed out to Imgur for your viewing now. :whew:

My Antique hand crank Buster Brown scroll saw
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I'm not going to tell anyone what scroll saw to buy.. That is totally up to you and what fits your needs!

But for the money today compared to the DeWalt dw 788 type 2 saw that I use.
https://www.dewalt.com/product/dw788/20 ... scroll-saw
And the Delta model:
https://deltamachinery.com/products/scroll-saws/40-694/

The new.. WEN LL2156 21 inch 1.6 amp scroll saw is one id be looking at price wise.. if I needed a new scroll saw today.
And because it has a few different design elements to the control's I like - 2 table top supports arms.. lower blade chuck guard doors for the dust collection port ..
also a lock on the lifting arm.. for keeping the lift arm up while threading your blade.
https://wenproducts.com/products/wen-ll ... teel-table
Last edited by whodathunkit on Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:10 am, edited 3 times in total.
What type of automobile can be spelled the same forwards & backwards?
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FatSebastian
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Re: scroll saw topic.

Post by FatSebastian »

whodathunkit wrote: Thu Mar 23, 2023 6:29 pmthe photo's are changed out to Imgur for your viewing now. :whew:
:thanks: This thread is much easier to understand now!
whodathunkit wrote: Thu Mar 23, 2023 6:29 pmThe WEN LL2156 21 inch 1.6 amp saw is one id be looking at if I needed a new saw.
What is it about this particular model saw that would make you want it? (Start a new thread as appropriate.)
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whodathunkit
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Re: scroll saw topic.

Post by whodathunkit »

Well FS,
Don't get me wrong hear I like my DeWalt 788 type 2 scroll saw.. over the years I've used it I have to add some features to it and fix a few things here and there.

For me personally and my scroll saw machine needs.. If I had to replace my mid level saw.. for the money the WEN mid level saw is priced right compared to the DeWalt and Delta models.

It has a few different features that I like.. that DeWalt and Delta models don't offer on there saws.

All 3 models use the flat blade type toolless chucks. For faster blade changes.

I like the lower blade chuck guard doors and dust port for when running the saw.
(Don't know if id run dust collection in long cutting sections because of the noise or not.. but it would be a big help with saw dust cleanup while cutting cars out in workshops.

The lock The Wen and Delta models offer on the lift arm is a very nice feature to have right of the bat ..
For holding the arm up to make the threading of the blade threw the work easy .

The Wen table top with two table bevel supports and square table design at a 21 inch cutting depth model .. Just looks stronger to keep the table square.
Over the 20 inch DeWalt and Delta models.
( With my DeWalt there is some Flex and shifting in the table top when pushing down on the outer edge's of the table.)
It's nice to have a little extra room for turning large work projects.. however I'll just twist the ends my pinless blades to 90 degree's and cut from a different direction.
( feeding the work from the sides of the saw if you will.) That's only if I'm not using the spiral blades.

Motor size on the Wen is 1.6 amp at 550 - 1600 strokes per min 3/4 in down stroke.. and 2 1/8" cutting capacity at 90.
Okay so DeWalt and Delta offer a 1.3 amp motor at 400-1750 STM with a 3/4 in down stroke. so there's not much difference!


With my DeWalt saw when it was new.. the lift arm on it was so very aggravating to me as it would keep falling down while I was threading the blade threw my work.
So I had to add this Jim Dandy lift system to my saw so this problem.. was not so problematic to me by not staying up and dropping down any more.
( It's the long black flat bar with holes and spring seen on the saw.)
Image
Here's a different style.
https://www.amazon.com/Scroll-Saw-Lifte ... 1192&psc=1

So the add-ons to the Scroll saws are the work light's and or magnifying glass with light, saw stands, lift arm systems, Foot peddle switches.
I had to buy all these little extra add - on's a little at a time.
Image

Plus Iv upgraded the stock blade chucks.. over to the new Pegas Blade chucks: ( these should fit on all 3 saw models, DeWalt, Delta and WEN.)
Stock DeWalt chuck seen left side .. Pegas chucks to the right:
Image
Here is a a link: to the product review on the Pegas chucks and why I chose to up grade the chucks on my saw as well.
https://scrollsawer.com/2018/09/07/prod ... uck-heads/

up dated Chucks:
Image
These have a larger set screw to true the blade in the chuck for 90. to the table..
and have a larger stronger holding area for the blades to be clamped down.
View of the Stock DeWalt chuck is thin and prone to spreading open over time and use causing alignment issues between the 2 chuck lock pens..
And the threads in the chucks for the clamping knob strip out with use as well.
Image
The chucks are ware items that will ware out over time.. and need replaced.

view of the open bottom blade chuck to my saw with no dust port to collect the saw dust.
Image
and single Bevel support to the table top with pen in the back of a teardrop table design.. With larger work your hands move out to help turn your work as your cutting.
Just a few things about my DeWalt saw I wish were better for my needs is the dust collection port. ( because of the saw dust that can get in your lung's while cutting .)

The thing about scroll saws is how much do you plan to use them. And what type of projects you are looking to do with one.
Small projects here and there with large inside cuts.. The lower end ( Starter saws) with pin / flat blade chucks are good for small projects every now and then.
But will ware out quicker with lots of use or with very long running cutting sessions.

If your looking to use a scroll saw for these long cutting sessions where your fret work cutting threading and unthreading the blade.. for hours on end of non stop use.
Like to sale your work's at craft shows. You’ll will want to get a better saw like the mid- level or even the higher end saw model's with a toolless blade chucks..
for faster blade changes.. There inner workings are built stronger for it.. But will also ware out over time and continuous hours use as well.

Here's an image the inner working's of my DeWalt 788 type 2 saw: What I'm fixing to do in this image is maintenance to link bar bearings and bushings..
Replacing the wore out ones. and repacking them all with synthetic grease.
Image

So there is something else to look at when looking for a scroll saw.. is the maintenance.. some of the older saws like the first saw pic of 1940's craftsman It used oil for it's lube.
The Dremel 1800 saw: use's a flat metal bar with roll pens for it workings that I kept having to fix as I was doing more with it and is why I move up into a better saw for cutting thicker wood's.
Here's an image I pulled for replacement parts showing the flat bar and roll pens to link the two arms together.
Image

For the DeWalt 788 type 2 model.
I've used since 2007 this is the 2nd go around in the 17 years I have ran the saw now.. for re-lubing and checking and fixing worn bearings and bushings to keep it in good running shape.
Last edited by whodathunkit on Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:26 am, edited 13 times in total.
What type of automobile can be spelled the same forwards & backwards?
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