If last night is an indication..

[CM924]

I may need some competition at our Pack PWD.

Last night at our den meetings I overheard one Dad tell another not to use graphite cause he believes it slows the cars down. Another Dad said he is planning on trying to put all his weight on the nose of the car this year and see if that helps, yet another kid brought his "finished" car in to show everyone and play with.

This is my first derby, so I have taken it upon myself to learn all I can to be competitive, but to hear comments like these from seasoned veterans makes me wonder what's going on with these people. Yes I am a competitive person by nature and I understand that it doesn't mean that much to others but with all the information available out there you would think they'd be a little more on top of it.

[PWD]

I think this is pretty typical. But then there are usually a few kids/dads that take it seriously and get on this another forums and put together a pretty competitive car.

[Pinewood Daddy]

We have no real competition in our Pack. The closest one crossed over last year. People complain about my boys always winning but they don't do anything to improve their cars.

I host workshops to build a basic car that will be competitive but state building a winning car takes many more hours. I could "coach" someone on how to a build a winning car, but that might be considered cheating or favoritism. And take alot of my time. I wrote an advanced PWD guide but most people (read: sane!) won't take the time or have the equipment to do it right.

[tmbnorm]

People complain about my boys always winning but they don't do anything to improve their cars.

I have not heard any complaints about anything in our pack, but my son has not won a pack race yet. He finished 4th his 1st year and 2nd last year. The 2nd place last year was to the fastest car anyone has ever seen. The boy with the fastest car is not back in scouts.

I did not see anyone trying to help my Son's baseball team last year when they only won 1 game. They were very young and quite frankly did not have a lot of talent. Other teams looked like adults compared to them.

My son and I take the Derby serious, but we also want to have fun.
I don't go deer hunting every weekend and then just slap a car together the week of the race. We have done a little to our cars most weekends for the past 2 months.

Winning is not the most important thing. Doing our best is.

[Gameday]

Sun Tzu on the Art of War:

Do not swallow bait offered by the enemy.

Humble words and increased preparations are signs that the enemy is about to advance.

And . . . oh, yeah, something about not underestimating your opponent.

All kidding aside, maybe you should offer to do a workshop to elevate the level of competition. I started doing that after my son's first year and it's been one of the most enjoyable aspects of PWD.

[Pinewood Daddy]

All kidding aside, maybe you should offer to do a workshop to elevate the level of competition. I started doing that after my son's first year and it's been one of the most enjoyable aspects of PWD.

My workshops have been used by father's who don't have the tools or don't want to setup to build a car. None of them cared about speed, just GetErDone!

It is satisfying to help them, but the kids did none of the work!

[CM924]

I have a relatively nice shop but in a very confined space, therefore tools need to be moved in and out of the work area as they are used. Setting up a workshop probably wouldn't work out well unless I had one team in at a time. Don't get me wrong I like the idea, because I would like to see more of the Parents/Kids get involved and be enthused but it isn't practical in the confines I have.

[PWD_addict]

I may need some competition at our Pack PWD.

Last night at our den meetings I overheard one Dad tell another not to use graphite cause he believes it slows the cars down. Another Dad said he is planning on trying to put all his weight on the nose of the car this year and see if that helps, yet another kid brought his "finished" car in to show everyone and play with.

This is my first derby, so I have taken it upon myself to learn all I can to be competitive, but to hear comments like these from seasoned veterans makes me wonder what's going on with these people. Yes I am a competitive person by nature and I understand that it doesn't mean that much to others but with all the information available out there you would think they'd be a little more on top of it.

If you try to say something to the "veterans", you'd probably only get a scowl. However, you can do what we did (not on purpose). We beat the Pack our Tiger Year. I offered to do a small presentation at our PWD workshop this year which helped the handful of boys that were there. Then, we went on to really crush the pack this year (Wolf). The Pack meeting two days after the Derby, when everyone knew that we had this PWD thing figured out, we told all the boys we'd help them build faster cars next year by giving a tutorial at the December Pack meeting when the boys get their cars. I can promise you that the boys and their parents are all very eager to hear the talk.

I am actually planning to incorporate the Science belt loop into my talk. Explain and demonstrate the Scientific Method by doing some experiments with gravity and superballs and explaining how it translates to Pinewood Derby. I'll try to write up what I did this past year and post it. Someone in our Pack is going to post it on Youtube at some point. The only other thing left to get the belt loop is to visit a place where science is used and talk to a scientist. That can be done at an aquarium, observatory or zoo, to name a few.

If you want to help out the boys who may not have as much parental help this year, you probably should, since they have no one else to point them in the right direction. Don't worry about the grizzled veterans--show them on the track. Their boys will ask them what you are doing right and what they are doing wrong!

[CM924]

I am more than willing to help anyone who wants it. In fact I have already committed to having a single Mom and her handicapped son over to help them design and cut out their car. All I am saying is that I do not have the space to do a full workshop for the entire Pack.

[PWD_addict]

Our Pack workshop is done in our meeting hall (thank you KofC). Some of the leaders bring in a few saws and sanders and drills. If your Pack doesn't have a workshop, there's not much you can do to help besides what you are doing.

Personally, helping one Den at a time would take up way too much of my (already scarce) time. That's why I'm just giving a presentation at the Pack meeting. I'll tell them what to do (and why) but can't help them do it very easily.

[BlackLotus]

It's interesting to see the different ideas. This was our first derby (Tiger) and I purposely did not incorporate a lot of speed tricks for two reasons.

First, I wanted to do what my son wanted to do and not push him for more time (when he got bored) so a lot of attention was spent making the car look fast.

Second, I didn't realy want to win the whole thing. There were enough people who made remarks making me believe they thought I built the car and put it in his hand for the race just because it looked good.

Third, This gives my son a chance to grow for next year and he is realy excited to make a faster car for next year.

Fourth, I like to see cars that the kid obviously had great input in the design. Rail cars look cool to me but there is something about having a wedge with flames and an alien figure driving the car. Especially when the 8 year old is giving the alien driving tips while waiting to stage. I was afraid that we might push the competition to the point that the boys had less input.

We still did very well and he took second place in tigers but, he is realy stoked to try some speed techniques next year.

[sporty]

CM924,

Perhaps they were just talking some pwd hype or mis-hype.

Most seasoned or veterans of pwd have caught on about what works and what does not.

But still a great deal do not visit forums like this one. Yet others lack the ability to comprehend the nature of a manual or tip guide.

I helped at three workshops for a local pack. You can get caught up with everyone wanting so much from you. That they are basically asking you to build the car for them.

It's hard to convey what you know to 10 to 20 people at one time or in three sessions.

I even printed out my own trickeled down tip guide so that most would understand it. I even gave some demonstrations.

Some parents and scout masters view PWD very differently. Either competitive or more just a fun event.

Enjoy the time and races, they go buy quickly.

Sporty

[Go Bubba Go]

I am more than willing to help anyone who wants it. In fact I have already committed to having a single Mom and her handicapped son over to help them design and cut out their car. All I am saying is that I do not have the space to do a full workshop for the entire Pack.

For the last 2 years I have provided a "tool free workshop" / tutorial to anyone who wanted it (Parents, that is).

The parents in our Pack seem to have few real issues with getting cars built, but more issues with understanding how to build them to get them to move right along.

Attendance has increased as my boys continue to do well (1st and 2nd in their rank and Pack this year) and the attendees of my workshops do well (several 1st or 2nds in rank this year among this year's attendees). Word gets around.

Building fast cars with your boy is fun. So is helping organizing a well run event. So is helping others have a better time with their boys.

Offer liberally, some will come and others will not. That's OK, just watch what happens with those that do

Bubba

[Jomo]

Man, that's helping the competition! J/K
I was the only person at our race that brought a scale, graphite and weights, I really enjoyed helping everyone out and even turned down money a couple times. A single mom that lives down the street asked if they could build their car in our garage next year. I was talking with her and my wife about how cool it would be to have an "outlaw" dads race next year. I would love to get together with the other dads and share secrets and maybe even make some new friends.

[Go Bubba Go]

...I really enjoyed helping everyone out and even turned down money a couple times. A single mom that lives down the street asked if they could build their car in our garage next year. I was talking with her and my wife about how cool it would be to have an "outlaw" dads race next year. I would love to get together with the other dads and share secrets and maybe even make some new friends.

Amen and then some...

I have met, helped, and been helped by a lot of really nice people through PWD and Scouting in general. There are the occasional "personalities", but the types of organizations and people that conduct PWDs are generally very decent people. As with many other things, the more you help others the more you get out of it, whether it be increased knowledge of your own, the satisfaction of helping someone else, development of lasting friendships, etc.

Too cool.

Bubba