How Important is Staging?

General topics of interest to racers and race coordinators alike.

How important do you think staging your car is?

Extremely
16
59%
Very
8
30%
Somewhat
2
7%
Not very
1
4%
It's all luck
0
No votes
I have no clue???
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 27

Jrob54
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How Important is Staging?

Post by Jrob54 »

Just curious what your thoughts are on staging your car at the start gate?

I know some people with rail riders say they like to drift as much as possible before the wheel rides the rail...others stage their dominate wheel right on the rail from the get go. Some prefer staging right in the middle. Anyone else have any input on this subject?
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psycaz
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by psycaz »

Having toyed with this issue for a while now, I can tell you it can make a HUGE difference in your times. Each cars does seem to be different, but I have seen a car's time vary at least .015 depending on staging. If I really put one on wrong (or just trying stuff), I can get it up to .025
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FatSebastian
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by FatSebastian »

:welcome: Jrob54! Interesting poll question - way to jump in with both feet. :thumbup:
rpcarpe
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by rpcarpe »

I staged 131 heats a couple of weeks ago.
Not knowing who had a RR, or not, I staged all cars centered over the guide strip.
Most cars returned pretty consistent results through their 4 runs on the track.
If you know what kind of staging is best for your car, and you get to stage it yourself, that would be even better.
Poorly staged cars can really have a slowdown, I've seen Cubs 'plop' down their cars, sometimes crooked and they lag off the line.
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by *5 J's* »

psycaz wrote:Having toyed with this issue for a while now, I can tell you it can make a HUGE difference in your times. Each cars does seem to be different, but I have seen a car's time vary at least .015 depending on staging. If I really put one on wrong (or just trying stuff), I can get it up to .025
So how do you stage?

I have taught my boy to stage centered on the rail - wheels to the axle heads. This year he ran a RR - should he have staged differently?
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by rpcarpe »

You should probably do some testing on a track to find your car's best staging method.
Will your son get to stage the car each time?

As previously suggested, stage your RR car with the DFW farthest away from the center guide, but no wheels touching the center guide. That way it runs 'free' of the center for the longest time.
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by *5 J's* »

rpcarpe wrote:You should probably do some testing on a track to find your car's best staging method.
Will your son get to stage the car each time?

As previously suggested, stage your RR car with the DFW farthest away from the center guide, but no wheels touching the center guide. That way it runs 'free' of the center for the longest time.
We don't have a timer on our test track so we would not be able to see the difference in times. Yes, scout's stage thier own cars up here.
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by Jrob54 »

Our scouts stage their own cars, although the starter is in charge of making sure they are on the track so that they won't fly off.
rpcarpe
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by rpcarpe »

Do you have a spare 'control' car to compare against on a two lane test track?
At the very least, please make sure your scout knows how to carefully handle and stage the car.
A kid at a Pack race this year saw his wheels 'wiggling' and pushed in the axle heads, from then on his car went slower and slower.
Please let us know how it goes.
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by *5 J's* »

rpcarpe wrote:Do you have a spare 'control' car to compare against on a two lane test track?
At the very least, please make sure your scout knows how to carefully handle and stage the car.
A kid at a Pack race this year saw his wheels 'wiggling' and pushed in the axle heads, from then on his car went slower and slower.
Please let us know how it goes.
I do have a "control" car and will try to see if I can see the results of differences in staging. I'm sure there is differences if I started with wheels on the rail - or wheels against the body. I talking about looking at the difference between centering on rail vice offsetting towards the DFW as much as possible without the non-DFW touching the rail.

My boy are real careful in the handling and the staging of thier cars.
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by Jeff Piazza »

Staging issues are something our pack's never really considered before.

A few weeks ago I had the opportunity to make some timed runs with a test car on our pack track, and I was surprised how much effect staging really has. For this RR test car, staging the DFW as far away from the rail as possible gave significantly faster times. I'll second psycaz' claim that staging can yield a 0.015 s difference; I saw that or more.

Each car is different, but I doubt that optimal staging strategies are, at least for cars that use RR successfully to avoid wiggles and rear wheel contact. The benefit of extra time off the rail is easy to understand, and I expect it would have to dwarf most car-to-car differences.

/JEP
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FatSebastian
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by FatSebastian »

Jeff Piazza wrote:For this RR test car, staging the DFW as far away from the rail as possible gave significantly faster times.
Generally speaking, does this mean that the rear wheels should be asymmetrically placed over the guide rail with the car (axles) parallel to the rail, or, should the rear wheels be centered over the rail and the direction of the car be "pointed" away from the rail and more toward the DFW? Or something else entirely?
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by doct1010 »

I think the axles are perpendicular to rail, unless I misunderstood.

I would agree with staging DFW as far from rail as possible. Low speed with limited wheel rotation takes its toll with early contact.
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FatSebastian
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by FatSebastian »

doct1010 wrote:I think the axles are perpendicular to rail, unless I misunderstood.
:thumbup: Just makin' sure. Thanks, Doc.
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Re: How Important is Staging?

Post by knotthed »

I have searched thru 10 pages of search results to find this post on "Staging".

Is there any difinitive information regarding staging available on the site?

My son got bumped out of the quarter finals at District last year due to poor staging(I think). The car he got bumped by went on to finish 2nd overall for the 1st graders. Not exactly sure what transpired, but they did 4 runs instead of just the usual 3(1 on each lane) up until that point. It was the final run that got him, it was very sluggish off the line.

It was our first year and we had no idea the boys would be staging their own cars, as they did not do it at the pack level.

This year I discussed staging the car and we just went for centered over the rails. I suspect that there is time to be gained though thru proper staging, staying off the rail longer should yield a better time due to less friction/rolling resistance at the start.

Our pack asked me to run the race for this year and I agreed, so I made sure the boys staged their own cars, thus prepping them for the seemingly tough single elimination district races that Sporty has raced in for years. I was blown away by some of the cars there - what an awesome experience.
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